Time to say goodbye to ZEVO and GreenBytes

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Re: Time to say goodbye to ZEVO and GreenBytes

Post by monkeyfoahead » Fri Oct 25, 2013 8:06 pm

So, I'm probably going to migrate from Zevo to MacZFS. BUT:

1) I have no backups (my pool is 12TB, i cant afford backups)

So its absolutely crucial that MacZFS won't f*ck up my pool, and will be reliable. Should I switch now? Or should I wait? How long should I wait?

Thanks
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Re: Time to say goodbye to ZEVO and GreenBytes

Post by ilovezfs » Fri Oct 25, 2013 8:13 pm

Come talk to me about this in #mac-zfs some time.
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Re: Time to say goodbye to ZEVO and GreenBytes

Post by ilovezfs » Fri Oct 25, 2013 8:28 pm

maxijazz wrote:How to install the mac-zfs from image (dmg)? How to use it? Any (even short) tutorial?

You can do something like this:
http://bit.ly/maczfsdmgdemo
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Re: Time to say goodbye to ZEVO and GreenBytes

Post by dukzcry » Sun Oct 27, 2013 12:13 pm

The one of the reasons why some still choose Zevo is the conservative memory management. In comparison, both MacZFS and ZFS-OSX eat a lot of ram, even when just a single pool is in use. Any plans to work on this problem?
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Re: Time to say goodbye to ZEVO and GreenBytes

Post by ilovezfs » Sun Oct 27, 2013 12:25 pm

We follow the standard ZFS Adaptive Replacement Cache (ARC) algorithm. The user can also set maximum ARC size. If you have something more specific, please come discuss it in #mac-zfs or create a new issue on GitHub.
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Re: Time to say goodbye to ZEVO and GreenBytes

Post by lundman » Sun Oct 27, 2013 7:20 pm

The short short version!

# wget http://lundman.net/ftp/osx.zfs/osx.zfs-20131025.dmg #Non-mavericks
# http://lundman.net/ftp/osx.zfs/osx.zfs- ... 131025.dmg # Mavericks
# open osx.zfs*.dmg
# cd /Volumes/osx.zfs*
# sudo ./load_zfs.sh
Copy and paste the "export PATH" line the script prints at the end.
# zpool status

Won't survive a reboot.
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Re: Time to say goodbye to ZEVO and GreenBytes

Post by dukzcry » Fri Nov 01, 2013 1:36 pm

ilovezfs wrote:We follow the standard ZFS Adaptive Replacement Cache (ARC) algorithm. The user can also set maximum ARC size. If you have something more specific, please come discuss it in #mac-zfs or create a new issue on GitHub.

Thank you! Setting of the ARC limit improved the situation.
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Re: Time to say goodbye to ZEVO and GreenBytes

Post by ilovezfs » Fri Nov 01, 2013 2:17 pm

dukzcry wrote:
ilovezfs wrote:We follow the standard ZFS Adaptive Replacement Cache (ARC) algorithm. The user can also set maximum ARC size. If you have something more specific, please come discuss it in #mac-zfs or create a new issue on GitHub.

Thank you! Setting of the ARC limit improved the situation.

You're welcome.
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Re: Time to say goodbye to ZEVO and GreenBytes

Post by grahamperrin » Fri Nov 01, 2013 2:26 pm

To Jolly/Patrick

Whilst I don't share your feelings about all points in your opening post, I do understand the reasons for you feeling as you do.

In the absence of information from GreenBytes, each person must draw his or her own conclusions. I respect your thoughts in these matters. I admire your restraint; your expertise and your patience.

jollyjinx wrote:… HFS+ is just intolerable in regards to data integrity.

P.S.: I'll switch to 10.9, I will keep my backups on a freebsd machine (on ZFS) to be sure that data does not corrupt after backing up, but on my main machine I will switch to HFS+ again.

A way to ensure consistent data for me is to have my important data being checked by git.


FYI: jdd.io — Bit rot concerns

OS X 10.9, Mavericks

… as a developer I need to work at least on the current version of the OS. … 


Your tweet about adoption of Mavericks is eye-opening. For most people, use of Mavericks is not yet essential. There are exceptions: I guess that new Macs will require Mavericks, and so on … 

… and your need as a developer is, without argument, a deal-breaker. It's beyond patience.

For what it's worth, I have been quietly frustrated since June 2013, when seed testing began. I can't say whether my frustrations as a seed tester were any more or less than your frustrations as developer, but believe me: the frustration has been deep, and enduring.

Key points from an e-mail to Apple, unsolicited, sent not long before 13A598 was seeded:

An explanation for my lack of involvement …


  • I use ZEVO for ZFS, for my home directory and much more
  • I'll not move down from ZFS to HFS Plus
  • the home directory is integral to my approaches to testing
– so for me, for most things, Mavericks has been simply unusable.

I'm not complaining, just explaining :-)
… 


That was, me to Apple.

Whilst Apple developed Mavericks: could I, should I, have applied greater pressure to GreenBytes?

I could have, on numerous occasions, but I restrained myself.

There was, at least, the June 2013 announcement that GreenBytes was no longer developing ZEVO. No point in applying pressure where there was simply no development. Moreover, I feel that it's not good to put pressure on developers; they know what's what and will do what's appropriate in their own time (not my time).

If GreenBytes had/has lined up a potential taker for ZEVO, I should expect not a whisper in public, until after details are finalised.

I did have a very reassuring conversation in June, and was eager – over-eager – in July. Then when Mavericks was GM but pre-release, I vowed to sit back for a fortnight after release. Sit back and say nothing, whilst the sparks fly. That was the plan :-) but I got caught in the sparks.

Now? I'm impatient to know what'll happen with ZEVO, but not impatient enough to imagine a deadline. Whilst I did pay a little money – to Ten's Complement – I have had more than my money's worth, and I never felt that the one payment should entitle me to perpetual upgrades. YMMV.

Ultimately I'm just another end user. Enjoying ZEVO. Maybe a minority, but with ZFS on Macs: that's not unusual. In the Mac user group for my county I'm a minority of one. The minority makes me no less happy with the product. Looking forward to whatever GreenBytes has up its sleeves.

If the sparks can stop flying for a week or so, I might make another call with the company …
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Re: Time to say goodbye to ZEVO and GreenBytes

Post by robballan » Sat Nov 02, 2013 11:11 pm

I have to say I completely agree with jollyjinx. I saw this coming and bought an ixSystems FreeNAS mini a couple of months ago, and started to move the data on most of my ZEVO external disks to that box. With Mavericks released I finished that process last week. Goodbye, ZEVO, very sad to see you go. But I have kept my eye on MacZFS and am modestly optimistic that it can provide a general replacement.
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